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PC MINS 19960203APPROVED 3/12/96 CITY OF RANCHO PALOS VERDES PLANNING COMMISSION ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3, 1996 The meeting was called to order at 9.10 A M by Chairman Clark at the Wayfarers Chapel Site, 5755 Palos Verdes Drive South. PRESENT- Commissioners Cartwright, Franklin, Ng, Whiteneck, Vice Chair Vannorsdall, and Chairman Clark ABSENT- Commissioner Alberio, (excused) Also present were Associate Planner Silverman, City Geotechnical Consultant Art Keene, and Recording Secretary Drasco. Representing the Chapel were Reverend Yenetchi, Member of the Board of Managers Victor Bothmann, Building and Grounds Engineer Chuck Batelle, and Architect Dean Andrews Local residents present were Bill Griffin, Joan Wright, Corinne Gerrard, Mike Shiles, Sharon Hegetsweiler, Lois Larue, Dave Ruth, and Bill Ruth Vice Chair Vannorsdall moved to accept the agenda, as presented, seconded by Commissioner Cartwright. Approved, (7-0). CONSENT CALENDAR: (NO ITEMS) COMMUNICATIONS Staff. Copies of Title 15, including the Landslide Moratorium Exception section were made available to the Commissioners Commission- NONE CONTINUED BUSINESS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NO. 185, VARIANCE NO. 388, GRADING PERMIT NO. 1793, AND ENVIRONMENTAL ASSESSMENT NO. 676-, Wayfarers Chapel, 5755 Palos Verdes South (TS) After a short discussion in the Chapel (due to the heavy rain) led by Chairman Clark, describing how the tour/onsite meeting would proceed, the group walked outside to the proposed building site Associate Planner Silverman showed the approximate location of the proposed two- story Visitor Center, indicating that the geology report submitted by the applicant's geologist had been approved by the City's Geotechnical Consultant Commissioner Franklin expressed concern about building to the property line. Associate Planner Silverman explained that there was a 15' setback requirement but a Variance, if approved, would allow building in the setback area She went on to explain that the Chapel had stated that Mr. Jim York, the adjacent property owner, had given his verbal approval for the Chapel to build to the property line The Planning Commission had suggested that the Chapel obtain written permission from Jim York, but he had been advised not to provide written permission. She listed the findings for a Variance and said that Staff felt the findings could be met At the Commission's request, the architect Mr. Dean Andrews, 1064 Upland Avenue, San Pedro, CA 90732, walked off the perimeters of the building in the parking lot. To Chairman Clark's query as to the choice of the building site, Mr Andrews replied that three locations were considered but that, the other two being were rejected because the land was not as stable in those locations, nor were as conducive to traffic circulation on the property Art Keene was asked his opinion regarding the stability of the land and he said that the selected location was stable and the other two were not When asked about the safety factor of the slope at the proposed building site, he said it was greater than 1 5 Mr. Dave Ruth, 4 Thyme Place, Rancho Palos Verdes, asked about the purpose of the building Chairman Clark said that it was to be a Visitors Center to replace the previous one PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3,1996 PAGE 2 • • Mr. Bill Griffin, 5 Ginger Root Lane, Rancho Palos Verdes, asked if the proposed building would be built into the bank at the rear of the proposed building site Mr Andrews said it would not but that a new retaining wall would be built Ms Corinne Gerrard, 22 Narcissa, Rancho Palos Verdes, asked the height of the proposed building, expressing her concern that the top of the Visitor Center would be visible from the homes above. Mr. Andrews said the rooftop would not be visible because of the height of the hill was substantially higher than the height of the roof. Mr. Bill Ruth, 4 Thyme Place, Rancho Palos Verdes, asked if outdoor weddings would be held at the amphitheater, stating that currently he could hear bells from the Chapel and another nearby church, which he thought was nice, but he did not want to hear the noise from a crowd Lois Larue, 3136 Barkentine Road, stated that she had lived in her nearby house for 33 years. She described her son's credentials as a geologist, indicating that he had told her that he did not think it was a good idea to build on the Wayfarers Chapel property She then asked who the City Geologist was Chairman Clark, Art Keene and Associate Planner Silverman said there were three Dr. Perry Ehlig, Dale Hinkle and Art Keene Associate Planner Silverman explained that there is a 20' wide sewer easement abutting the property line on the adjacent property which could not be built on anyway, so effectively there would be a setback area next to the new building. At Vice Chair Vannorsdall's suggestion, the group moved down the parking lot toward the street to view one of the alternative building saes Associate Planner Silverman pointed out that the site was preferred by the local residents, but not by the Chapel, because of the difficult access from that site up the steep hill to the Chapel. Next, the group walked to the amphitheater area near where the previous Visitor Center had been located PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3, 11996 PAGE 3 During the discussion at this site, it was revealed that the number of permanent seats (simple benches) to replace the capacity of about 100 people sitting on the grass (since this arrangement was difficult for the elderly) had been reduced from 160 to 100. In addition, no exterior lighting and no amplified sound were to be allowed, and there might be a small stage near the amphitheater area in front of the sidewalk. It was clarified that temporary seating on the gravel area might still be brought in (as had been done in the past at Easter) for a total capacity of about 200 people Reverend Yenetchi stated that he believed the sound from the amphitheater might actually be less of a problem than in the past for the residents above the Chapel since the building had been removed because previously the sound had bounced off the building and traveled up the hill Mr. Bill Ruth asked what type of services would be held at the amphitheater area Associate Planner Silverman replied that there would be baptisms, memorials, as well as weddings, and other religious ceremonies, including Christmas and Easter services Mr Ruth asked if permission to lift the restriction on lights and amplified sound could be requested by the Chapel at a later time. Chairman Clark clarified that they would have to make another application to change the Conditions of Approval, if the City granted the Conditional Use Permit Mr Ruth and Ms. Gerrard asked about other specific restrictions which were to be placed on use of the amphitheater area, including sound decibel levels Associate Planner Silverman said that she had not brought the entire project file with her, but they could call her at the office and she would provide the details A discussion ensued following Commissioner Whiteneck's raising the issue of security measures which revealed that there had been numerous calls to the Sheriff by several residents and that there had been recent improvements to the Chapel's security system, including motion sensitive lights, and that the Chapel had hired a security company to drive through the property regularly Ms. Gerrard described her calls to the Sheriff and expressed concern not only for the security of the Chapel but also for the safety of people walking up the hill from the Chapel toward the residences above to admire the view. She was concerned that someone would be hurt or killed on the steep slope and that the Homeowners Association would be held liable. PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3,1996 PAGE 4 Lois Larue said that she did not see that the new structure was a replacement She believed the purpose of the new building was going to be different than what she had understood the purpose was of the previous structure The group then reassembled in the Chapel for final comments Vice Chair Vannorsdall asked Mr Andrews, the project architect, if he could provide the Commission with a drawing of the exterior of the proposed building Mr Andrews said he could provide this and Associate Planner Silverman said that she would make sure that the Commissioners received the drawing at the next hearing Vice Chair Vannorsdall read from minutes of August 8, 1995 Planning Commission meeting and questioned Art Keene's seemingly contradictory statements in which he said that the land was not moving but then said that the movement was being improved by dewatering wells Mr Keene explained that dewatering wells were not needed in order for this particular site to remain stable, but that they were used for stabilization in other areas Vice Chair Vannorsdall asked if there would be caissons included in the construction of the new building and Mr Andrews and Mr. Keene said that they were not needed Commissioner Cartwright asked if the Chapel had requested an extension because they have not been able to meet with neighbors or because there were new issues to discuss and, if the latter was the case, what were the new issues Mr Victor Bothmann explained that the son of the original architect, Eric Wright, who had worked with his father on the Chapel, had expressed an interest in the project and was going to draw some sketches, hoping to maintain the original feeling of the Chapel Mr Bothmann further stated that the Executive Board of Managers was meeting with Mr. Wright the last weekend in February He also mentioned that the neighbors had been invited to a meeting but only Ms Gerrard had attended Commissioner Franklin asked if the Commission could be provided, at the next meeting, a map showing the location of the building in the parking lot, indicating the property lines, the easement, etc. Mr Bill Ruth asked if there were to be rest rooms and kitchens in the new building and, if so, would a holding tank be required PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3,1996 PAGE 5 Mr. Andrews said that there would be sewage pump to the pressurized line at Palos Verdes Drive South He added that he had met with the County Sanitation District who informed him that there was a sewer line on the other side of the property that would become active in the future for use from Narcissa to Palos Verdes Drive South and that the Chapel would be included at that time. Ms. Gerrard asked if there would be a kitchen. Mr Andrews said there would be at least sink. Ms. Gerrard stated that she agreed with Lois Larue that this proposed building would not be a replacement She stated that the previous one story structure with the colonnade was compatible with the topography of the beautiful site She was also concerned about the stability of the land at the proposed building site and the security and noise issues for the neighbors above. Ms. Gerrard indicated that she had spoken with Eric Wright also and was pleased that the Chapel was working with him In reference to the meeting with the neighbors, she explained that there was a problem with the mailing and she was called the night before and, therefore, was the only neighbor who attended Mr Griffin clarified that he was concerned only about the landslide and saving residents' homes and that he did not mind what the Chapel did otherwise Chairman Clark stated that the meeting was to include a tour of the residential properties above the Chapel but that the bad weather made this unfeasible and that the tour would be rescheduled. Commissioner Ng asked if she could see the original plans for the Chapel Chairman Clark asked if she meant the plans from 1949 and she said yes Associate Planner said that there was a copy at City Hall that she could review Commissioner Ng asked if she could have a copy Mr Chuck Batelle said that there were a few copies at the Chapel Chairman Clark moved to continue the public hearing to March 12, 1996, seconded by Commissioner Cartwright. Approved (7-0). PUBLIC HEARINGS. (NO ITEMS) PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3,1996 PAGE 6 NEW BUSINESS. (NO ITEMS) ITEMS TO BE PLACED ON FUTURE AGENDAS: Staff NONE Commission NONE COMMENTS FROM AUDIENCE (regarding non -agenda items)* NONE ADJOURNMENT. Commissioner Cartwright moved to adjourn to the next regularly scheduled meeting on Tuesday, February 13, 1996, at 7.00 P M Hesse Park. The meeting was duly adjourned at 10 25 A.M. MIUSERSUACKIDIWPWIN60NINUTESl96PCMN2 3 PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES ADJOURNED MEETING FEBRUARY 3,1996 PAGE 7