PC MINS 19810324Ohl
M I N U T E S
City of Rancho Palos Verdes
Planning Commission
Regular Adjourned Meeting
March 24, 1981
The meeting was called to order at 7:34 p.m. in the City Council Chambers,
30942 Hawthorne Boulevard, by Chairman Brown.
PRESENT: Hinchliffe, Hughes, McTaggart, Brown
LATE ARRIVAL: Baer
ABSENT: None
Also present were Associate Planners Gary Weber and Richard Thompson.
Dr. Baer arrived at 7:36 p.m.
CONSENT CALENDAR
Dr. Brown removed from the Consent
Calendar consideration of the minutes
of the meeting of March 10, 1981, to
be discussed following New Business. On motion of Dr. Baer, seconded by
Mr. Hughes, the remainder of the Consent Calendar was unanimously passed,
thereby granting a six-month time extension for Tentative Parcel Map No.
7559.
TENTATIVE TRACT MAP NO. 38848 Mr. Weber said this item was last
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NO. 69 heard on February 10, at which time
Southwest corner Crest & Crenshaw the applicant and staff were directed
Applicant/Landowner: Rutter to provide additional information.
Development Company He said based on the information re-
ceived from the City Attorney concern-
ing condemnation of the corner parcel,
staff recommended that the Commission proceed with the proposed map and
require an access easement be provided to the Texaco site. Re street
design, he said a 'IT" intersection is now proposed, that it has been re-
viewed and found to be satisfactory by the Public Works Department. He
reviewed the modifications to the access entryways. He said per the Com-
mission's direction the applicant revised the walkway/bikeway design, now
proposing a minimum eight -foot wide meandering trail with trees. Staff
felt the grading plan was acceptable and met the intent of the Code. He
said the Geology Section of the County Engineer completed its review and
staff has received a letter recommending approval subject to conditions
which have been included in the tract map resolution. He referred to the
detailed view analysis which was on display and discussed it at great
length. Staff recommended approval of the conditional use permit subject
to the draft resolution and conditions and further recommended that the
Commission recommend to the City Council approval of the tentative tract
map. He referred to the additional conditions recommended by staff and
distributed to the Commission this evening.
In response to Commission questions, Mr. Weber said the ridgelines would be
kept at as low a profile as possible near the public right-of-way. He said
the interior homes were proposed to be higher but that they would not fur-
ther impair the views. He said the analysis was based on a worst case
situation. He said all of the rim lots were proposed at 16 feet but that
the applicant was now requesting the option of higher structures with the
use of a site line.
Dr. Brown noted that this was a continued public hearing.
Clark Leonard, Lanco Engineering, said they read and agreed to the condi-
tions as stated in the draft resolutions but had not yet seen the latest
additional conditions. (Mr. Weber handed him a copy.) He said they ac-
cepted the ridgelines set by staff. He said their design called for some
one-story and some two-story homes, the same type of homes as those at The
Ranch. He noted that the two-story homes were narrower than the one-story
and would, therefore, open up wider view corridors. He said they did not
feel there should be a consistent one-story appearance along the rim. He
said each floor plan had three to four elevations, that there were certain
lots that each home could go on. He pointed out that there were ridgeline
heights established for each lot which could not be exceeded.
Mr. Hughes asked with a 5:1 slope how far back the rim homes would have to
be to not be seen from below (Palos Verdes Drive South).
Mr. Leonard said at a height of 16 feet, homes would have to be 80 feet
back. He said they were proposing staggered setbacks. He said they were
amenable to treatments such as hip roofs instead of gable in view -impacted
areas. He said a higher structure set back further from the rim would be
no more impactive and possibly less impactive than a 16 -foot structure built
close to the rim.
Don Owen, Cayman Development Company, said they have not pre -plotted any of
the homes, that they would like to give buyers an option to buy a home of
their choice for a lot of their choice. He said they had six basic floor
plans with options for differing elevations and roof configurations. He
urged the Commissioners to look at The Ranch, which was a 50-50 mix of one
and two-story homes. He noted there were specifications saying that a
particular home can only be placed on certain lots. He said the ridgelines
limit what homes can go where. Re the rim lots, he felt a mixture with a
few two-story homes would make a better street scene. He noted that a two-
story home has a smaller footprint even though it is 25 percent larger.
On motion of Mr. Hughes, seconded by Mr. Hinchliffe, and unanimously car-
ried, the public hearing was continued.
Dr. Brown said perhaps the applicant should prepare a model for the Commis-
sion's review as was required for the Burrell tract.
Mr. Hughes said unless the Commission was going to require the applicant to
firmly place structures on the site, a model would not show anything and
would be a waste of time and money. He thought staff's approach was very
thorough but wanted to discuss the possibility of moving some of the homes
back from the rim.
Mr. McTaggart agreed that it was too late in the process for the Commission
to ask for a model since the applicant's marketing plan does not include
precise locations for homes within the tract.
Mr. Leonard said they would like to obtain approval tonight, if possible.
Mr. Hinchliffe asked if staff felt comfortable working out a solution for
the rim lots with the applicant.
Mr. Weber said he would have no problems as long as the direction from the
Commission was clear.
The direction from the Commission was to not have a wall of homes along the
rim, to allow some sort of staggared effect.
Mr. Hughes said Conditional Use Permit (CUP) condition #7.f. should be
modified to provide for solar access and not permit its blockage by land-
scaping. He said the new CUP condition #13 should be modified to read
"Prior to the consumation of initial sale of each lot, the buyer shall be
apprised .......
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Dr. Baer said CUP condition #10 should be modified to read "'.....without
first obtaining approval for a conditional use permit.....'"
Mr. McTaggart said CUP condition #10 should be further modified to reflect
that no provision for lights has been approved by the Planning Commission,
and no conduit or electrical wiring, -etc., shoizld-be-instAlled-without-first
obtaining approval for lights.
Mr. Weber noted that with the addition of a new CUP condition #13, the
existing condition #13 would become #14.
Mr. McTaggart said the new Tract Map condition #43 should be modified to
read ....... swales should be constructed of earth tone colors (brown,
beige, or.....'"
Mr. Weber suggested the addition of a new CUP condition #14 to read "Prior
to the approval of a final map, a plot plan shall be submitted to and
approved by the Director of Planning which establishes staggered setbacks
from the rim." He said with this addition the existing last -condition would
become condition #15.
Mr. McTaggart suggested modifying CUP condition #11 to be more specific and
require that in addition to not permitting solar panels to exceed the maxi-
mum ridgeline, they not be permitted to be placed so as to increase any
view impairment.
On motion of Mr. Hughes, seconded by Mr. Hinchliffe, and unanimously carried,
the public hearing was closed.
Mr. Hughes proposed a motion, seconded by Mr. McTaggart, to adopt Resolution
P.C. No. 81-35, thereby approving Conditional Use Permit No. 69, subject to
the conditions of Exhibit "A", as amended this evening.
Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Baer, Hinchliffe, Hughes, McTaggart, Brown
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
Mr. Hughes proposed a motion, seconded by Dr. Baer, to recommend to the
City Council approval of Tentative Tract Map No. 38848, subject to the
draft resolution and conditions of the attached Exhibit "A", as amended
this evening by the Commission.
Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Baer, Hinchliffe, Hughes, McTaggart, Brown
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
Dr. Brown advised that the actions by the Commission are appealable to the
City Council within fifteen calendar days.
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NO. 74 Mr. Thompson said this request was for
VARIANCE NO. 60/GRADING NO. 492 a professional (non-medical) office
Northwest corner Crest & Hawthorne building. He reviewed the background
Applicant: Neil Stanton Palmer of the project and the proposed revi-
Landowner: Universal Trade & Ind. sions. He said the access would be
taken from Crest Road. He said the
parking ratio had been reduced, thus
reducing the size of the parking lot and the amount of grading and eliminat-
ing a retaining wall. He said the interior parking plan had been revised
and improved. Staff approved of the parking lot circulation as proposed,
assuming that the support columns which separated some of the parking
spaces were set back a minimum of two and one-half feet from the drive
aisle. Staff -recommended approval of the pro3ect subject to the draft reso-
lution and conditions.
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0
Public hearing was opened.
John Manavian, project designer, Neil Stanton Palmer, said the building was
designed to enhance views. He said the signing would probably be at the
entrance to the building, but that a sign location was not called out yet.
He said they would work within the sign controls of the City. He noted that
an integral part of the design was to make the project look like a single
family structure.
Elizabeth Kramer, 6810 Crest Road, representing the Monte Verde Homeowners
Association, expressed concern about the proposed driveway on Crest Road
and the excess traffic. She said Crest Road was a long cul-de-sac with
over 300 families. She was very concerned about the traffic congestion.
She said they had hoped the access for this,site would be off Hawthorne
Boulevard instead. She pointed out that no one was aware of who the office
holders would be and the hours that traffic would be generated from the
site, etc. She did not feel a restriction for "no right turns on a red
light", as suggested by staff, would be helpful.
Mr. Hinchliffe said there was far more traffic on Hawthorne Boulevard and
that it was in the best interests of the public, for safety reasons, to
have access to the site off Crest Road instead of Hawthorne Boulevard.
Dr. Brown added that the Commission previously spent a great deal of time
on the issue of traffic and that Hawthorne Boulevard has a 45 miles per
hour speed limit at that point, which would create far greater problems.
Mr. J. R. Moss, 6405 Chartres Drive, representing the Palos Verdes Monaco
Homeowners Association, expressed concern about the proposed parking which
he felt was deficient. He was concerned that people would have to park on
Crest Road or in the Hughes Market parking lot. He also expressed concern
about the proposed access point and felt it would be a real hazard.
Thomas Alley, 6304 Sattes Drive, representing the Palos Verdes Monaco Home-
owners Association, was concerned about the reduction of the parking re-
quirement. He felt a 40 -percent reduction was substantial, that the request
was excessive and should be denied.
Mr. McTaggart asked staff if the location of the driveway with respect to
the Hughes Market driveway was considered to be a hazard.
Mr. Thompson said staff felt the best location for access wa.s as proposed.
He displayed a photograph showing the relationship of the proposed driveway
to Hughes Market. He said there was a critical distance between driveways
that must be maintained if they do not line up perfectly.
On motion of Mr. Hughes, seconded by Mr. Hinchliffe, and unanimously carried,
the public hearing was closed.
In response to Commission questions, Mr. Thompson said staff surveyed other
cities and discovered that the normal parking ratio was one space per 300
square feet. He said Rancho Palos Verdes requires one space per 150 square
feet (net leasable), because medical is permitted. He said this project
proposed no medical and, therefore, staff felt the proposed parking ratio
was not unreasonable.
John Manavian said required employee spaces would depend on the usage, that
insurance offices required more than a lawyer's office or an accountant's
office.
Mr. Hinchliffe felt the parking ratio was adequate_ He said there would
not be an insurance company because they would need more space.
The rest of the Commission agreed the proposed parking was reasonable.
Mr. McTaggart and Mr. Hughes were uncomfortable with the proximity of the
roof to the ground and felt it would be an attractive nuisance which would
easily allow children to climb up there. They felt a roof, four and one-
half feet off the ground, was too low in an area where there would be
public access.
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Dr. Brown said he recognized the concern but felt the impacts had been
greatly reduced because of the revised design, that the original massive-
ness of the structure had been greatly reduced. He also felt the proposed
roof pitch would discourage anyone from getting up there.
Mr. Hinchliffe and Dr. Baer concurred with Dr. Brown.
Mr. McTaggart proposed that the roof be no less than seven feet off the
ground at any point to prevent small children from getting up on the roof.
Mr. Manavian said there was a lot of street lighting in the area and that
it was not a well -traveled or hidden area. He said there was nothing
functional about the extension, that it was an architectural projection
designed solely for aesthetic purposes.
Mr. Hinchliffe proposed a motion, seconded by Dr.
P.C. No. 81 -36, -thereby approving Conditional Use
No. 60, subject to the conditions of Exhibit "A".
Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Baer, Hinchliffe, Brown
NOES: Hughes, McTaggart
ABSENT: None
Baer, to adopt Resolution
Permit No. 74 and Variance
Mr. McTaggart stated his negative vote was due to the fact that, in his
opinion, this project represented a significant public hazard due to the
roof being four and one-half feet off the ground.
On motion of Mr. Hinchliffe, seconded by Dr. Brown, and carried, with Mr.
Hughes and Mr. McTaggart dissenting, Grading Application No. 492 was
approved.
Dr. Brown advised of the right to appeal this decision to the City Council
within fifteen calendar days.
RECESS
At 10:24 p.m. a brief recess was called.
The meeting reconvened at 10:32 p.m.
with the same members present.
TENTATIVE PARCEL MAP NO. 12578
Mr. Thompson said this request was to
North & east of 26231 Silver Spur
create two residential lots and adjust
Road (portion Valmonte Canyon)
the property line of the lot on which
Landowner: Ascension Lutheran
the church is situated. He discussed
Church
the access. Staff felt that no signi-
Applicant: South Bay Engineering
ficant view obstruction would result
if the structures were built 16 feet
high. Staff recommended that no devel-
opment be permitted on slopes greater than 35 percent extending to the rear
property line adjacent to Rolling
Ridge Road to preserve the canyon area.
Staff recommended that the Commission open the public hearing and take
public testimony. It was further
recommended by staff that the Commission
approve the tentative parcel map
subject to the conditions listed in Exhibit
"A" of the draft resolution.
In response to Commission questions, Mr. Thompson said they could not control
structures on the parcel map. He said the existing Code permitted a 16 -foot
high structure on the site, that anything higher would require a height varia-
tion, and that if there was view obstruction the application for a height
variation would be denied. He said he understood the church was considering
expansion but said that would require a separate application and Planning
Commission approval and is not part of this request.
Public hearing was opened.
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I * 9
Ron McAlpin, South Bay Engineering, agreed with the conditions except for
condition #7, where he preferred more flexibility. He said it could just
specify no development where the slope exceeds 35 percent. He said they
preferred a note on the map that each lot represents one building site
only, rather than require that the building site be delineated on the map.
Dr. Brown asked if access rights have been obtained from Rolling Ridge
Road, which was a private street.
Mr. McAlpin said no, that they felt if the purchaser of the lot was able
to obtain access, he could build on what they felt was the better portion
of the lot; if not, he would have to build*on-the other portion. Re condi-
tion #13, he said it should be specified for Lot B, that they proposed to
maintain access from the frontage road.
Darrell Peddy, 25614 Amberleaf Road, Torrance, representing the church,
felt the project would enhance the area. He asked how the parkland figure
was derived in condition #21. Re condition #22 he felt it should be re-
quired of the buyer of the development and not the subdivider. Re condition
#24 he said it would cost about $65,000 to improve Silver Spur Road. He said
if they were restricted to a particular building site, it may affect the
value of the property.
William Kelso, 5117 Oconto Avenue, member of the church, said one of the
prime locations was the northwest corner of the site. He felt it would be
to the advantage of Rolling Ridge Road to get another dues -paying member.
He felt conditions V, #13, and #22 were restrictive and felt they should
be reworded or delayed at this time. He said condition #24 was like signing
a blank check, since no one knew at this time what the costs would be.
Edward Valdes, 26325 Silver Spur Road, expressed concern about traffic
problems and fire access.
On motion of Mr. Hughes, seconded by Dr. Baer, and unanimously carried, the
public hearing was closed.
Commission discussion ensued. The Commission had no problem allowing devel-
opment at either end of Lot C but opposed development anywhere except the
upper end of the canyon on Lot B. The Commission said conditions #22 and
#24 were normal conditions placed on all subdivisions. It was further the
consensus of the Commission that the landscaping condition was adequate as
worded.
Mr. Hughes proposed a motion, seconded by Mr. Hinchliffe, to adopt Resolu-
tion P.C. No.. 81-37, thereby approving Tentative Parcel Map No. 12578,
subject to the conditions of Exhibit "A" as amended this evening, changing
condition #7 to reflect that development of the lower area of Lot C would
be permitted (instead of the upper area) if proof of access from Rolling
Ridge Road was obtained, and changing condition #13 by adding "for Lot B."
Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Baer, Hinchliffe, Hughes, McTaggart, Brown
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
Dr. Brown advised of the right to appeal this decision to the City Council
within fifteen calendar days.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES On motion of Mr. Hughes, seconded by
Mr. McTaggart, and unanimously carried,
the minutes of the meeting of March 10,
1981, were approved with the following amendments: page 1, last paragraph,
line 2, should read "...Via La Cresta involved the destruction of natural
features in the Open Space Hazard zone and the required blasting. He...";
page 3, 5th full paragraph, line 2, should read "...shake shingle next...";
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page 3, 7th full paragraph, line 5, should read "...pointed out the knoll
about..."; page 4, add to paragraph 1, "He also indicated that the 1T�mita-
tion of the Open Space Hazard zone be verified and that suitable cross
sections be provided with proposed grading for access roads in the upper
area."; page 5, add as paragraph 3, "Dr. Baer recommended that a wider
design would accomplish the objectives of the development without the
limitations of the high building profile."; page 6, add as paragraph 3,
"Dr. Brown asked Mr. Boettcher if he was aware of the City's Development
Code and knew of its ordinances regarding fences prior to his installation
of the fence. Mr. Boettcher repliedthathe was aware of the Fence Ordi-
nance and the Develo2ment Code prior to the installation of the fence.";
page 6, original paragraph 3, line 2, should read "...proceed with the
fence."; and page 6, add as paragraph 6, "Dr. Baer provided information
that he recognized that the subject fence was a common design on a western
range."
STAFF REPORTS Mr. Weber said the Planning Commission
minutes were currently prepared re-
flecting the testimony received and
the action taken, and briefly summarizing pertinent Commission discussion,
unlike the City Council minutes which were strictly "action minutes". He
said minutes were not meant to give a verbatim account of the meeting and
that obviously every statement could not be included. He requested that
the Commission not make changes to the minutes unless something crucial is
omitted or is in error.
COMMISSION REPORTS Mr. Hughes reported on the Ordinance
Subcommittee's review of the measure-
ment of lots fronting on private roads.
He said the Subcommittee felt all lots should be treated the same, whether
fronting on a private or public right-of-way. Hd said if the City allows
the right-of-way easement to be counted in the lot size, they end up with
lots smaller than what is required by Code. The Subcommittee further recom-
mended that the Glossary be revised, specifically the definition of driveway.
He submitted suggested wording.
On motion of Dr. Brown, seconded by Mr. Hughes, and unanimously carried,
the Planning Commission recommended to the City Council changing Section
9611 of the Development Code and the Glossary, as suggested by the Ordinance
Subcommittee. Staff was directed to transmit this recommendation to the
City Council.
Dr. Brown reported that on Thursday, March 12, the Planning Commission
chairpersons of the other Peninsula cities met with him at his home. He
felt the meeting was worthwhile and said they have scheduled to meet again
next month.
Mr. Hughes reported on the seminar that he and Mr. McTaggart attended in
Irvine on how to become better Planning Commissioners.
Mr. Hinchliffe said he would not be able to attend the next meeting.
ADJOURNMENT At 11:46 p.m. it was moved, seconded
and carried, to adjourn to Tuesday,
April 14, 1981, at 7:30 p.m.
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