PC MINS 197611230 (04)
M I N U T E S
City of Rancho Palos Verdes
Planning Commission
Regular Adjourned Meeting
November 23, 1976
The meeting was called to order at 7:38 p.m. in the City Council Chambers,
30942 Hawthorne Boulevard, by Chairperson Shaw.
PRESENT: Blue, Hughes, McTaggart, Shaw
ABSENT: Rosenberg
Also present were Director of Planning Sharon Hightower and Associate Plan-
ner Gary Weber.
MINUTES APPROVAL Mr. McTaggart proposed a motion which
was seconded by Mr. Blue to approve
the minutes of November 9 as submitted.
As there was disagreement over the wording of the third paragraph on page
three, the motion and second were withdrawn and this item continued until
later in the meeting.
On motion of Mr. McTaggart, seconded by Mr. Hughes, the work session minutes
of November 11, 1976, were approved.
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NO. 19 The public hearing was opened, and
TENTATIVE TRACT NO. 32677 Mr. Weber gave the background of the
Highridge, south of Hawthorne Blvd. request, describing the proposal, the
Applicant: Cayman Development Co. location, and the proposed grading,
pointing out the differences between
the proposal and the Code -established
criteria. He suggested the Commission first concentrate on the grading.
He said the Fire Department feels one access is usually not enough, and
Staff recommends an additional one. Staff proposes that the major issues
be discussed tonight and the item be continued to the next meeting, at which
time Staff will present specific recommendations.
Speaking in favor were Jack Stone, president and representative of the Pea-
cock Ridge Homeowners' Association, 5987 Peacock Ridge Road, and Gus Bartos,
homeowner at same address. They felt the proposed grading would reduce the
impact on views, that there was not a natural grade existing now, and that
especially with landscaping, etc., the project would be a definite improve-
ment over what now exists.
Glen Shaffer, Cayman Development Company, 608 Silver Spur Road, Rolling
Hills Estates, showed cross section view analyses and drawings, pointing
out the differences between the proposed and allowable. He further explained
that one-story dwelling units require more grading and leave less open space
than two-story dwellings. He showed an aerial photo and explained that by
grading as proposed, with the structures moved closer to the apartments,
they were offering more view to those living in the surrounding area; and
he felt the Code did not consider conditions of this type.
Don Owen, also of Cayman Development Company, discussed views and impacts
with the use of the cross section analysis.
Ms. McAfee (living in the apartments) said she was not opposed to the
development of the hill, but was concerned about the existing traffic prob-
lems in the area and the impact this project would have. She wondered if
Highridge Road would ever be completed.
Mr. McTaggart asked about the status of the bike path plan. Director High-
tower said it was still undecided between Traffic Committee, Council, and
Rolling Hills Estates. Mr. McTaggart requested a copy of the bike path
study and plan, and expressed concern that the proposed entrances would
possibly be in conflict with the proposed path.
The public hearing was declared closed.
In response to questions of the Commission, the applicant said that the
highest ridge line would be at 1236 feet; the maximum building height would
be 30 feet; the minimum spacing between blocks of units would be 20 feet;
the streets would be split in elevation; the setbacks would be staggered;
there would be private outdoor open space in the way of patios, decks/bal-
conies, but no fences above 42 inches; and that per the Commission's request,
he would submit preliminary renderings (which would be of traditional medi-
terranean styling).
The Commission further discussed the driveway slopes and access, and con-
cern was expressed about the large terraced areas. The feelings of the
Commission were that visibility of the development would be very limited;
there are no natural slopes existing; the grading would enhance the views
of the surrounding properties; overall it meets the kinds of changes the
Commission has been discussing for the grading ordinance and is a reason-
able approach to the site. They were concerned about the amount and angle
of the fill and felt all slopes should be treated in a natural manner.
The Commission requested that staff address some of the created slopes at
the Ravenspur end, i.e. how decreasing the slope would affect the project.
On motion of Mr. McTaggart, seconded by Mr. Hughes, and carried, this item
was tabled until the next regular meeting.
At 9:20 p.m. a brief recess was
called. The meeting reconvened at
9:20 p.m. with the same members
present.
GRADING NOS. 106, 107, 108 Mr. Weber described the location and
Via Campesina, Lots A, B, C the request, explaining that all con -
Applicant: Robert Hellweg struction was proposed for the extreme
slopes and the proposed grading was
excessive. There would be large pad-
ded living areas, but no view obstruction. Staff recommendation is that the
application be tabled pending revision of the plans or be denied based on
the findings listed in the staff report.
Robert Hellweg, applicant, said he was in a joint venture with Smith Realty
(owner of Lot B) and Mr. Horowitz (owner of Lots A and C). He pointed out
that these were separate homes and not one development. He gave the back-
ground of the lots and discussed the existing access easement in the front
portion of the lots. He explained that he has explored other ideas, but
they are not feasible.
Ron McAlpin, South Bay Engineering Corp., spoke about the grading, indicat-
ing that the existing slope is 1,:l.
LaVerne Yakubik, 26101 Basswood, spoke in favor and referred to a letter
from her husband (Andrew Yakubik) dated October 28. Staff gave the Commis-
sion a copy of this letter to read.
Some of the Commissioners were concerned about the large area to be carved
out, and felt the grading was excessive considering the steepness of the
slope. They questioned having swimming pools on these lots, as they would
necessitate an even larger flat pad; and that although pools were nice
amenities, they were not necessary. They also wondered if a nine -foot liv-
ing area would be very usable.
Other Commissioners felt that padding for the pool would not be objection-
able if the dirt comes from the site itself; that if the houses were built
into the slope, there would be no light coming into the rear portion of the
house, no outdoor living area, and no way to walk around the houses. It
was pointed out that the proposed setback is in accordance with the zoning
requirement, the project meets the 30 -foot height limit, and there exists
an almost impossible slope.
In response to some of the concerns expressed, Mr. Hellweg said
yards would be terraced, with the swimming pools on a different
the houses, and the wall would be low; he could use a different
the rear
level than
configuration,
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have more separation between the homes, and have more deck area on the
second floor; and he further explained that he cannot bring the houses
forward without encroaching into the 20 -foot easement.
The Commission felt they would like to review these proposals more care-
fully at a work session. They explained to the applicant that no decision
would be made at that session, but that the Commission would be looking at
them along with the proposed grading revisions.
On motion of Mr. Blue, seconded by Mr. McTaggart, and carried, this item
was tabled until the next regular meeting.
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NO. 20 _I11r. Weber gave the background of the
GRADING NO. 111 request, indicating the present use
SIGN PROGRAM and the proposed use of staff quar-
30804 Hawthorne Boulevard ters in an institutional district.
Applicant,: William Roberts He identified the project location on
the map; explained that the designs
of the structures vary and the maxi-
mum height would be 21 feet; described the surrounding area and the pro-
posed access which would be a 500 -foot cul-de-sac; and showed the location
of a ten -foot wide sewer trunk line easement. He then reviewed the criteria
as shown in the chart (in the staff report); said Staff suggests the size
of the parking spaces be changed; and explained that the major concern is
grading and that due to the size of the site, Staff has tried to identify
what is referred to as a sphere of influence. He said the structures would
not be highly visible and there would be no view obstruction. Staff recom-
mendation re grading is for two revisions as listed in the staff report,
page 5. Staff recommendation re the conditional use permit is for approval
subject to the nine conditions listed in the staff report, page 6.
The public hearing was declared open.
William Roberts, applicant, discussed the grading, said the cul-de-sac could
be moved back (per staff's recommendation), and answered questions of the
Commission.
In response to questions, Mr. Weber showed cross sections and explained
what the created slopes would be and the grading effect, saying there would
be one large flat pad for the homes, with terracing. He showed elevations
of two different plans and said there was a third plan which was similar.
Mr. Roberts added that the design is somewhat standard for the Salvation
Army personnel.
As there were no further speakers, the public hearing was declared closed.
The Commission agreed with Staff's recommendation that the slopes be made
more gentle. They questioned having a retaining wall of five feet and
during discussion of the sewer easement, the applicant explained that the
Sanitation District raises no objection with the plans and is sending a
letter so stating.
The Commissioners concurred that they wished to have the grading plan re-
drawn showing less grading and slopes which are more natural in appearance,
and so directed the applicant to revise his plan.
On motion of Mr. Blue, seconded by Mr. Hughes, and carried, this item was
tabled until the next regular meeting, and that if the applicant is unable
to submit the plans prior to this meeting, Staff should schedule this item
for another agenda.
Regarding the sign program, Director Hightower said there existed a differ-
ence of opinion in regard to the legality of the existing signs, and that
this seemed a good time to clear up this matter. She explained the signing
provisions of the institutional zone and described the existing signs and
their location. Staff recommendation is for approval of the signs subject
to the three conditions listed in the staff report.
Mr. McTaggart said he was opposed to illuminating signs, particularly being
so close to the public right-of-way, and felt they were a safety hazard.
He also felt that allowing this would be precedent setting.
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Mr. Roberts said they often have visitors and cadets who are strange to
this area and because the streets are so dark and the facility is not visi-
ble from the road, without the illuminating signs, the facility would be
impossible to find.
In response to a question, City Attorney Pat Coughlan said that directional
signs are permitted in the median, but must be City signs.
Although the other Commissioners agreed that the subject sign attracts
attention, they did not feel it was a safety hazard. They felt that a cer-
tain amount of signing was necessary, particularly in the dark, to enable
strangers to find the facility.
Mr. Blue proposed a motion, seconded by Mr. Hughes, to approve Signs #1 (two
signs) and Sign #2 subject to the following conditions:
1. The blank signboard shall be removed within thirty (30) days.
2. The applicant shall dim the illumination level of the signs to
eliminate the "halo effect" within thirty (30) days.
3. The applicant shall apply for the appropriate electrical permits
within ten (10) days.
Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Blue, Hughes, Shaw
NOES: McTaggart
ABSENT: Rosenberg
HEIGHT VARIATION CRITERIA Mr. Coughlan explained that the City
Council was concerned that the Com-
mission may be applying architectural
or aesthetic standards for houses. He felt the word "compatible" may be
causing a problem, and explained that the Council did not intend for any
aesthetic consideration, but rather how many two-story houses were now
existing in the neighborhood, etc. He said the word "neighborhood" was
not necessarily limited to mean individual subdivisions, but might have a
much broader definition. He explained that the goal was to give the Com-
mission and Council as much flexibility as possible.
He stressed the importance of making findings, explaining an application
must pass all six findings, and that the Commission must base its decision
on these findings. He said if the Commission makes its decision and re-
quests staff to draft the findings to present at the next meeting, the
recorder should so state what was being done and why, as all actions must
be justified.
When asked, Mr. Coughlan said there was no legal obligation to consider
neighboring cities in reaching a decision. If someone offers legal objec-
tions, he said the secretary should write them down, read them back to be
sure they are correct, and the Commission should state that these will be
submitted to the City Council.
OTHER LEGAL QUESTIONS In answer to questions concerning the
grading revisions, Mr. Coughlan ad-
vised using negative wording, i.e. "no
grading on slopes of over 35% except on those lots which have been previously
subdivided and meet certain standards." He agreed with the suggestion that
no new lots should be created with all 35% slope. Another suqgestion was
to require a geological report on lots with slopes over a specified percen-
tage. He said having an applicant sign a waiver does not legally release
the City of all responsibility.
STAFF REPORTS Director Hightower explained that
Staff was occasionally asked for
phone numbers of the Commissioners,
and since there was no existing policy, Staff requests the Commissioners
to designate which numbers, if any, they would like given to citizens.
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The preferred numbers are as follows:
Blue = either work or home number
Hughes = just office number
McTaggart = home number, after 6 p.m.
Shaw = home number
Staff is to check with Mr. Rosenberg at the next meeting.
MINUTES On motion of Mr. McTaggart, seconded
by Mr. Blue, the minutes of the meet-
ing of November 9, 1976, were approved
as submitted. Roll call vote was as follows:
AYES: Blue, McTaggart, Shaw
NOES: Hughes
ABSENT: Rosenberg
ADJOURNMENT At 12:20 a.m. it was moved, seconded
and carried to adjourn the meeting
to Thursday, December 2, 1976, at
7:30 p.m.
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